 End Times #1 (11 views) Subscribe   
  From:  David (DavidABrown)    5/15/2001 5:46 pm  
To:  ALL   (1 of 15)  
 
  33.1  
 
End Times
Eschatos (2078) Eschatology last, end, in chronological order, the last as opposed to the beginning. Hora (5610) Hour time, times, day, season, duration Verses - John 6:39 Acts 2:17 2Tim 3:1 1Pet 1:5,20 2Pet 3:3 1John 2:18 Jude v. 18
First Use: Genesis 49:1 And Jacob called unto his sons, and said, Gather yourselves together, that I may tell you that which shall befall you in the last days.
End times or last days are signified as the last times that man will be out of the perceived presence of God. End times does not mean the end of the world or the end of time it means the end of mans separation from God. Since the beginning of creation God has been revealing Himself to mankind. Since the fall of mankind God has continued to reveal Himself, but to a separated mankind. When God and mankind are fully reunited, God will continue to reveal to man who He is, but man will no longer be guessing about God. Man will be in the perceivable presence of God.

The end times are a call, to mankind that the end of separation from God is almost over. The call to man is to prepare to meet God, prepare to meet our maker. 1John 2:18,28 Little children, it is the last time:.. And now, little children, abide in Him; that when He shall appear, we may have confidence, and not be ashamed before Him at His coming.

Excerpt from the book
Basic Christian Theology
By David A. Brown

The days that we are currently living in are the End Times. These are exciting Times. The Bible has much to say about the End Times. This is a new topic where we are going to Discuss just that, End Times.

Be prepared to present and to defend your views of the biblical End Times.






David A. Brown
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  From:  David (DavidABrown)    5/16/2001 6:15 pm  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (2 of 15)  
 
  33.2 in reply to 33.1  
 
Basic End Times 
I think that in end time discussion what is of first and foremost importance is to define the Christian Church. The church has a beginning and it also has an end. It is the end of the church here on earth that is always a difficult idea to grasp. We as Christians often get so Church centered that we tend to think that what we call the Church has always existed and will always exist. Not so, Noah, Abraham, Moses, King David, even John the Baptist are all loved by God and are with God in heaven right now, yet not one of them was ever a Christian.

The Christian church as we know it began at a specific moment on a specific day. The day is the Sunday that Jesus Resurrected from death. The Church Still commemorates the Resurrection of Jesus and the beginning of the church by meeting/assembling on Sunday. The church is not a collection of buildings or the names of denominations. The church consists of people. People are the Church. The exact moment people became the Church was on Resurrection Sunday when Jesus Breathed/Baptized the people gathered in the upper room and told them to receive ye the Holy Ghost this is the Born Again occurrence of a Christian. Notice Jesus said to receive this, after we as individuals acknowledge by faith the Resurrection of Jesus, Jesus then Personally Breathes the Holy Spirit into us. We do not feel or experience anything at this Baptism, we are saved by Faith not by experiences. Later when we have additional over flowing baptisms of the Holy Spirit and of Fire, theses are experiences that we experience. On resurrection Sunday no-one spoke in tongues. Later at the Experience of Pentecost baptism the experience of speaking in tongues occurred.

John 20:22 And when He (Jesus) had said this, He breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost.

The church consists Only of Born Again Christian believers. Everyone who Acknowledges that Jesus is Alive and has received the Baptism of the Holy Spirit from Jesus by Faith is a Born Again Christian and a member of the Church in which Jesus is the Authority. This is very Important and very significant. God created mankind Adam and Eve in a sinless condition both of them disobeyed God and ate of the fruit. To disobey God is sin and sin is death (separation from God). To be Born Again is to Have Gods Spirit back inside of us the way God originally intended mankind to be. Those with the Spirit of God are in the family of God as Children of God. Those who do not acknowledge the resurrection of Jesus are not, born again and are not Children of God.

The Church consists of all the children of God. The world consists of all the non-children of God.

Being a child of God means that we are in the Spiritual Image of God, We have Received from God His Spirit. This has happened because we acknowledge that we are sinners and that Jesus died for our sins. Sin is no longer an issue, as long as Jesus is acknowledged. The children of God are cleansed by the blood of Jesus from sin. The people of the world are still dirty in the eyes of God, having rejecting Jesus.

This is where end times can get confusing. God is going to Judge the earth and the people that are on it, this is Gods desire/wrath. Wrath means passionate desire. It is Gods passion to Judge the earth. Judge means to make a distinction and a separation, like right from wrong or light from darkness. Here is the interesting part God is going to judge the world yet there is this group of Gods Children currently still on the earth, they are called Christians. God does not have wrath for Christians because they already acknowledge Him, we are His children. God is going to remove His children from the earth prior to judging the earth. This is an event called the Rapture of the church. This is the end of the Church here on earth. The church of Born again believers that began on resurrection Sunday 2,000 years ago will be transferred to heaven, before God Judges the earth.

1 Thessalonians 1:9,10 For they themselves (new Christians) show of us what manner of entering in (visiting) we had unto you, and how ye turned from idols (worldly desires) to serve the living and true God; And to wait for His Son from heaven, whom He raised from the dead, even Jesus, which delivered (on the Cross) us from the wrath to come.

Next Article: will go into detail about the coming rapture of the Church.






David A. Brown
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  From:  BCaslow   5/21/2001 9:08 am  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (3 of 15)  
 
  33.3 in reply to 33.2  
 
David, 
It's good to see the pre-Tribulation stance being backed. I have searched through many forums; it seems that the pre-tribbers are few and far between. 

I don't know if you have had many dealings with post-tribbers, but what I find time and time again from them is this: 

They spend a vast majority of time attempting to debunk the pre-trib rapture than they do supporting their 'understanding'. 

God Bless, 

Bill

Fruit of the Vine Bible Study 
 
  
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  From:  David (DavidABrown)    5/21/2001 11:45 am  
To:  BCaslow   (4 of 15)  
 
  33.4 in reply to 33.3  
 
Yes I agree. 
The entire Bible scope and content goes out the window with post-trib accounts. That's why I think it's important to understand the church, and in understanding the church you can easily see the need for the pre-trib rapture. And the fact that the pre-trib rapture is totaly supported biblicaly.




David A. Brown
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  From:  BCaslow   5/21/2001 12:08 pm  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (5 of 15)  
 
  33.5 in reply to 33.4  
 
AMEN! 


Fruit of the Vine Bible Study 
 
  
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  From:  DW (DeathWish123)   6/9/2001 8:34 pm  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (6 of 15)  
 
  33.6 in reply to 33.1  
 
Hello. I have been looking around your forum for the past couple of hours. Firstly I must admit that I am an ex-christian. I am simply looking for a new path. The nail in the coffin for me was Catholicism. I just did not like the idea of the church contradicting itself thousands of times. I also did not like being told what is right or wrong by a man who did not even speak my language. So really I spent most of my teenage years criticizing the church and making fun of it. But now I have been surrounded by evil, and I need to look for a light. This is my first post, hopefully not my last. Sorry if I sound cynical. But sadly I do not really like religious zealots like you. It is my belief god created christianity for those that were destined to find the light. It was not designed to be shoved down someone's throat until they either choke or goto church. But I ramble. 
What makes you so certain that Jesus was ressurected on a Sunday? Also, what calender? The calender we use currently did not account for leap years, so with all of the leap years, Jesus may have been ressurected on a Wednesday for all we know. Also, at the time Jesus was executed there was only 7 months I think, but I do not truely know. 

 
  
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  From:  David (DavidABrown)    6/9/2001 9:06 pm  
To:  DW (DeathWish123)   (7 of 15)  
 
  33.7 in reply to 33.6  
 
I appears that somehow you think that you have license to be rude, to Christians, I hope if you reply, that you will choose to be a little more respectful, as a common courtesy to everyone who reads the posts. 
Maybe we have already gotten off on the wrong foot. 

Im not really accustomed to people who dont know me referring to me as a zealot like the ones that they don't like. Ok, you dont know me Im not forcing you to spend hours on this forum. Did you spend the hours looking for something to criticize? 

With that said, each of the four Gospels in the Bible record that Jesus Resurrected on the first day of the week. Sunday is the first day of the week. 

Saturday is the last day of the week the Jewish day of rest, that God commanded in the Ten Commandments. 

The post a walk with Jesus 2,000 years ago covers the last week Jesus spent on the earth. That post might be helpful. 





David A. Brown
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  From:  DW (DeathWish123)   6/9/2001 9:16 pm  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (8 of 15)  
 
  33.8 in reply to 33.7  
 
I apoligize for sounding rude. And no I did not spend hours looking for something to criticize. I guess I "jumped the gun" and thought of you as a zealot. But by your actions you do somewhat portray yourself as one. You seem to have the entire bible memorized, and you seem to not allow individuals the right to look for other religions if they do not find Christianity to be their religion. By now I sound like I am attacking you. I most certainly am not. I am just pointing out my observations as a new observer. 
I do realize this is off subject, but when do you believe Christ was born?
 
  
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  From:  WendyJM1    6/9/2001 9:18 pm  
To:  DW (DeathWish123)   (9 of 15)  
 
  33.9 in reply to 33.6  
 
"Deathwish" - I too was raised in Catholicism and understand the cynicism that it (and any of 'man's religions') can create. 
I would like to ask you a question... your words said: 

"...But now I have been surrounded by evil, and I need to look for a light" 

Are you looking for "a" light - or "THE" light of the world? Jesus alone (not an organization or 'church') saves and HE IS the light of the world. The Gospel of John (ch.1:4-5) says: 

speaking of the Lord Jesus: 

"...In him was life; and the life was the light of men. And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not". 

John 3:19- "And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved. But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God". 

John 8:12: "Then spake Jesus again unto them saying: "I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life". 

John 3:3: "Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God". 

wendy 
www.delphi.com/realife1/start 




 
  
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  From:  David (DavidABrown)    6/9/2001 9:35 pm  
To:  DW (DeathWish123)   (10 of 15)  
 
  33.10 in reply to 33.8  
 
From what I know about Christianity & the Bible, God is an Awesome God! I wouldnt want to be in the shoes of anyone who mocks God.
I suspect that Jesus was born around our October, that would coincide with the Jewish Feast of Tabernacles. I think Jesus was born on the Jewish feast day of Tabernacles.

A tabernacle is a tent, a temporary structure to live in. Where the Temple is a permanent structure. Our current physical human body is referred to in the Bible as a Tabernacle/tent. After we physically die, Christians will receive a new permanent Spiritual body compared to a Temple.

John 1:14 And the Word (the Bible) was made flesh and dwelt (tabernacle) among us, and we beheld His Glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and Truth.






David A. Brown
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  From:  Dr_Shock   6/12/2001 2:45 am  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (11 of 15)  
 
  33.11 in reply to 33.10  
 
Have you ever taken into account the Russian Orthodox dates for Jesus's birth and death? Russian Christmas (if I can remember from my childhood correctly) is around the 6th of January. I've been told by a couple non-Orthodox people that there is good reason for this although I can't recall myself (my mom told me when I was a kid that it had something to do with Bible references and lunar placement). The Orothodox also celebrate Easter on a different day than most other Christians (the first Sunday after the first full moon after the Passover). 
Just wondering if you ever took this into consideration. Then again, no one, Christian or otherwise, ever does. Not a lot of people like the Orthodox, I guess. =)


-The Mad Dr. Shock
 
  
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  From:  David (DavidABrown)    6/12/2001 11:21 am  
To:  Dr_Shock   (12 of 15)  
 
  33.12 in reply to 33.11  
 
Thanks for the info.
From what I understand about the birth of Jesus, Shepherds are in the field at night watching over their flocks. This is not a winter activity, but a spring, summer and fall activity to spend the night in the field with the sheep, this would rule out both December and January.

Luke 2:8 And there were in the same country shepherds abiding in the field, keeping watch over their flock by night.

We do know more about the events of the Crucifixion of Jesus as the Bible Centers on the Crucifixion and Resurrection of Jesus.

The Passover Feast when Jesus was Taken and Crucified is a Feast that occurs during the Full Moon. God had a specific reason for making it a full moon feast. When the moon is visible as a full moon it is on the opposite side of the sun and the moon cannot create a Lunar eclipse of the Sun, and darken the day.

On the day that Jesus was crucified the day was darkened from noon until 3:00 pm. A supernatural event. An event prophesied in the Old Testament.

Matthew 27:45 Now from the sixth hour (noon) there was darkness over all the land unto the ninth hour (3 p.m.).

* This is from the Old Testament Prophet Amos who wrote 750 years before the birth of Jesus.
Amos 8:9,10 And it shall come to pass in that day, saith the LORD God, that I will cause the sun to go down at noon, and I will darken the earth in the clear day: And I will turn your feasts into mourning, and all your songs into lamentation; and I will bring up sackcloth upon all loins, and baldness upon every head; and I will make it the mourning of an only son, and the end thereof a bitter day.

Leviticus 23:5 In the fourteenth day of the first month (Jewish month of Nissan) at even is the LORDs Passover.

The Jewish month went from new moon to new moon. The 14th of the month would always be the Full moon phase.

For more information see the Post A walk with Jesus 2,000 years ago.






David A. Brown
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  From:  Zebra30   6/14/2001 12:45 am  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (13 of 15)  
 
  33.13 in reply to 33.7  
 
Actually, David, "zealot" need not be a dirty word as we are commanded to be zealous for the Word of God and for the testimony that we hold. But if you want to follow Jesus, as DW implied you should do so because you WANT to, not because someone pushed you to do something. 
  
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  From:  David (DavidABrown)    6/14/2001 8:25 am  
To:  Zebra30   (14 of 15)  
 
  33.14 in reply to 33.13  
 
I agree I think being a sold out Christian  zealot is a good thing! 





David A. Brown
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   From:  Natureboy (Vamp_Rob)   6/22/2001 7:55 am  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (15 of 15)  
 
  33.15 in reply to 33.12  
 
Do you have any idea what the climate of the Judean region is? 
  
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